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Faith and Reason 32: Bountiful

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From the book: Of Faith and Reason: 80 Evidences Supporting the Prophet Joseph Smith

By Michael R. Ash

After a long journey that probably took several years, the Lehites finally came to Bountiful –a land of “much fruit and also wild honey” (1 Nephi 17:5) Here they camped and built a ship for the final leg of their journey to the Americas. According to the Book of Mormon, Bountiful was a fertile place with vegetation, shipbuilding timber, flint deposits for making tools, and a nearby mount where Nephi’s brothers nearly threw Nephi into the sea.

Located precisely where we would expect to find Bountiful is the Arabian site of Khor Kharfor –the most naturally fertile location on the Arabian coast. There are fresh water springs, timber trees up to forty feet in circumference, wild honey, and small game animals. Until recently there was a sheltered sea inlet from where one could launch a raft (it is now closed by a sand bar). Towering on the west side of the bay is a mount where Nephi could have prayed, and 120-foot cliffs where Nephi’s brothers could have threatened to throw off their younger brother.

Geologists have recently found nearby iron deposits and forms of flint from which Nephi could have fashioned tools. All the items necessary to meet the description of Bountiful is found on the Dohfar coast just as described in the Book of Mormon.

Michael R. Ash is the author of: Of Faith and Reason: 80 Evidences Supporting The Prophet Joseph Smith. He is the owner and operator of MormonFortress.com and is on the management team for FairMormon. He has been published in Sunstone, Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought, the Maxwell Institute’s FARMS Review, and is the author of Shaken Faith Syndrome: Strengthening One’s Testimony in the Face of Criticism and Doubt.  He and his wife live in Ogden, Utah, and have three daughters.

Julianne Dehlin Hatton  is a broadcast journalist living in Louisville, Kentucky. She has worked as a News Director at an NPR affiliate, Radio and Television Host, and Airborne Traffic Reporter. She graduated with an MSSc from the Maxwell School of Citizenship and Public Affairs at Syracuse University in 2008. Julianne and her husband Thomas are the parents of four children.

Music for Faith and Reason is provided by Arthur Hatton.

Articles of Faith Podcast #22 – Neal Rappleye – Making God in Our Own Image to Cast Aside His Prophets

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neal-rappleyeNeal Rappleye volunteers with FairMormon, The Interpreter Foundation, and writes on his own blog called Studio et Quoque Fide. He is currently attending Utah Valley University and working towards a degree in History, with a minor in Political Science. He served a mission for the LDS Church in the Virginia Richmond Mission from August 2006 to August 2008. He joins us today to talk about an article that he wrote on his blog, the entry is entitled, Making God in Our Own Image to Cast Aside His Prophets.

Questions addressed in this episode:

While a more direct rebuttal to an article featured on the Rational Faith’s blog by Lori Burkman, entitled Disgracing God to Save a Prophet. The themes in the article and the general principles are the points I wish to focus.

In that article on Rational Faiths, there is an assumption that the author makes, and frankly, others have made as well. That is that God would not have commanded polygamy. That conclusion is compounded by the idea that, consequently, Joseph Smith must have been a mistake of Joseph’s own making. How do you answer that concern?

Part of the arguments that are presented by both articles are a perceived allegiance to God or Prophet’s almost to the point that they are mutually exclusive choices, it is one or the other. In Lori’s article her assertion is in her title, defending Joseph is seen as disparaging God. Your counter argument seems to be that Lori, and perhaps others that share her conclusions, are creating a god that fits what they feel comfortable worshiping, they create a god they can agree with, rather than seeking to find a way to agree with God as he is, regardless of the comforts that are in jeopardy with such an assumption. In some ways it sounds like you are both making the same argument but in different directions. So what makes your way, more agreeable in your sight?

For those that engage in reading blogs and various material found online, even from those professing to be members of the church, is a troubling undercurrent, and this is brought up in your article that is, “that people seem know better what God’s will is than do his chosen prophets, past and present.” Perhaps you could elaborate on that point.

There is a point that I think is interesting to consider when looking at any critique of either the church or its teachings. In your article you project or even take the path of Lori’s rationale to its next logical step. You say, “She would replace a God who commands polygamy under some circumstances with one that is inept in actually guiding his Church, or alternatively chooses (for some reason) entirely inept leaders.” Is this the conundrum so to speak, when people open the door to eroding prophetic authority with church practices? Is this the conclusion that they must then face? Is this the kind of God I believe in?

I would love it if you could read your own words, the concluding paragraph of the article as I believe it puts a nice conclusion on both this interview and the article:

I don’t like polygamy any more than you do. Personal experience of my own makes it very hard for me to cope with the idea that God would command his prophet to do something that could so deeply hurt and seemingly betray his wife Emma. I very much feel for Emma and admire the courage she showed during such a trying part of her life. I am not saying God is to blame for every action (related to polygamy) of Joseph Smith, or Brigham Young or anyone else trying to live this difficult command from God. But faith requires that we come to terms with the things God does that we don’t really like—not pawn all the blame onto his prophets who are imperfectly but sincerely trying to follow his will.

Fair Issues 75: How did Noah’s ark and Jaredite barges get light and air?

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MAThe story of Noah, or some equivalent figure, is found in a wide array of ancient non-biblical literature and could have easily have been known to the ancient Jaredites.  Some of these traditions about the Ark – or “deluge boat” – contain details and oddities not found in the Bible.

In this podcast brother Ash talks about how the Jaredite barges along with Noah’s ark may have been built to not only withstand the strong winds of sea travel but to also allow proper ventilation and light during their voyages.

The full text of this article can be found at Deseret News online.

Brother Ash is author of the book Shaken Faith Syndrome: Strengthening One’s Testimony in the Face of Criticism and Doubt, as well as the book, of Faith and Reason: 80 Evidences Supporting the Prophet Joseph Smith. Both books are available for purchase online through the FairMormon Bookstore. Tell your friends about the Mormon Fair-Cast. Share a link on your Facebook page and help increase the popularity of the Mormon Fair-Cast by subscribing to this podcast in iTunes, and by rating it and writing a review.

The views and opinions expressed in the podcast may not reflect those of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints or that of FairMormon

 

 

Faith and Reason 31: Raw Meat in the Book of Mormon

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From the book: Of Faith and Reason: 80 Evidences Supporting the Prophet Joseph Smith

by Michael R. Ash

After turning east at Nahom and continuing their journey to Bountiful, we read that the Lehites suffered many afflictions and had to live on “raw meat” because they were not to make fire frequently (1 Nephi 17:12). Early critics found this strange because little was known about ancient Arabia when they made this charge. According the Near Eastern archaeologist Dr. Jeffery Chadwick, the Lehites probably didn’t make much fire because of the lack of firewood and kindling and because they probably travelled in the cool of the night and rested during the day when no fires for visibility were needed. Dr. Hugh Nibley wrote that many desert travelers ate goat and sheep kidney raw –with a bit of salt. Others ate entire slices of flesh raw, or scorched it quickly over a small fire. In either Nibley or Chadwick’s scenario, the actions of the Lehites and their eating of “raw meat” are consistent with what we now know about ancient Arabian travelers.

Michael R. Ash is the author of: Of Faith and Reason: 80 Evidences Supporting The Prophet Joseph Smith. He is the owner and operator of MormonFortress.com and is on the management team for FairMormon. He has been published in Sunstone, Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought, the Maxwell Institute’s FARMS Review, and is the author of Shaken Faith Syndrome: Strengthening One’s Testimony in the Face of Criticism and Doubt.  He and his wife live in Ogden, Utah, and have three daughters.

Julianne Dehlin Hatton  is a broadcast journalist living in Louisville, Kentucky. She has worked as a News Director at an NPR affiliate, Radio and Television Host, and Airborne Traffic Reporter. She graduated with an MSSc from the Maxwell School of Citizenship and Public Affairs at Syracuse University in 2008. Julianne and her husband Thomas are the parents of four children.

Music for Faith and Reason is provided by Arthur Hatton.

Articles of Faith: Samuel M. Brown – First Principles and Ordinances (Book)

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headshot-MikeStack-2014-09-24-art-background-croppedSAMUEL M. BROWN is Assistant Professor of Pulmonary and Critical Care Medicine and Medical Ethics and Humanities at the University of Utah and an intensive care physician in the Shock Trauma ICU at Intermountain Medical Center. His award-winning book In Heaven as It Is on Earth: Joseph Smith and the Early  Mormon Conquest of Death was published by Oxford University Press in 2012. He is also translator of Aleksandr Men’s Son of Man: The Story of Christ and Christianity. Here is here today to talk about his book First Principles and Ordinances: The Fourth Article of Faith in Light of the Temple being published by the Neal A. Maxwell Institute for Religious Scholarship.

Questions addressed in this interview:

Your book addresses, among other things, the topic of faith, but your journey through your own faith crisis becomes an important backdrop for your perspective as a writer. Perhaps you could give the cliff notes version of that to set the stage.

Your book is part of the Living Faith Book Series that is being put out by the Maxwell Institute at BYU. As I understand the series as a whole, and therefore part of the feel and function of your book, is the reconciliation of faith and knowledge which is particularly notable challenge some are having in discourse about Mormonism. How do you seek to approach the challenge of reconciling faith and knowledge with your book?

There is a statement that opens the promotional one-sheet that I received on your book that was quite gripping and thought provoking. I don’t know if you wrote it or if it was someone with the publishing side of this effort, but I want to share it and give you a chance to expound upon that in context of your book: “Familiarity can lead to a kind of blindness in life and in religion. The first principles and ordinances of the Latter-day Saint gospel are particularly at risk for misunderstanding through such familiar neglect.”

While not set up in such a way that it addresses critical questions that some may have about the church, there is a sort of positive apologetic angle, almost devotional feel to your book. Is that a fair assessment?

Your book addresses active faith initially. This is something that I have been studying and feeling for years now so it was nice to see some confirmation in your writings to that idea. You speak of two main models of faith at least the way Latter-day Saints talk about Faith, what are those two models?

Faith and Reason 30: Nahom

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Nahom

Image of Nahom from The New Era

From the book: Of Faith and Reason: 80 Evidences Supporting the Prophet Joseph Smith

by Michael R. Ash

 In 1 Nephi chapter 7, not long after their departure into the wilderness, Nephi and his brothers return to Jerusalem to bring Ishmael and his daughters (which later become the wives of Lehi’s sons). In chapter 16 Ishmael died during their journey through the Arabian Peninsula and in verse 34 we read that Ishmael was buried “in the place that was called Nahom.” Ancient Hebrew did not use vowels, so NHM could have been translated with the use of various vowel sounds including Nahom as found in the Book of Mormon.

In the late twentieth century, a non-LDS German archaeological team was excavating an ancient temple in southern Arabia when they discovered the inscription of a man belonging to the tribe of NHM. A few years later, two more altars from the same excavation were also found to contain the tribal inscription of NHM. Since this area had been utilized for more than 2500 years (and was actively used during the days of Lehi,) non-LDS scholars have suggested that—in typical Near Eastern Fashion—NHM was not only a tribal name, but the name of a territory in which this tribe lived. This becomes even more interesting when we recognize that NHM was the largest burial site in all of ancient Arabia, and starting in around 600 BC (the same time that the Lehites fled Jerusalem,) anyone could be buried there.

Michael R. Ash is the author of: Of Faith and Reason: 80 Evidences Supporting The Prophet Joseph Smith. He is the owner and operator of MormonFortress.com and is on the management team for FairMormon. He has been published in Sunstone, Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought, the Maxwell Institute’s FARMS Review, and is the author of Shaken Faith Syndrome: Strengthening One’s Testimony in the Face of Criticism and Doubt.  He and his wife live in Ogden, Utah, and have three daughters.

Julianne Dehlin Hatton  is a broadcast journalist living in Louisville, Kentucky. She has worked as a News Director at an NPR affiliate, Radio and Television Host, and Airborne Traffic Reporter. She graduated with an MSSc from the Maxwell School of Citizenship and Public Affairs at Syracuse University in 2008. Julianne and her husband Thomas are the parents of four children.

Music for Faith and Reason is provided by Arthur Hatton.

Fair Issues 74: What happened at the Tower of Babel?

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MAIn Genesis we are told that following the confusion of tongues the people were scattered across the earth (11:7-9).  Many people have traditionally assumed that the scattering or dispersion, was caused by the divergence in languages.

In this episode brother Ash explores the possibility of a serious drought and  strong winds that could have contributed to this event.

The full text of this article can be found at Deseret News online.

Brother Ash is author of the book Shaken Faith Syndrome: Strengthening One’s Testimony in the Face of Criticism and Doubt, as well as the book, of Faith and Reason: 80 Evidences Supporting the Prophet Joseph Smith. Both books are available for purchase online through the FairMormon Bookstore. Tell your friends about the Mormon Fair-Cast. Share a link on your Facebook page and help increase the popularity of the Mormon Fair-Cast by subscribing to this podcast in iTunes, and by rating it and writing a review.

The views and opinions expressed in the podcast may not reflect those of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints or that of FairMormon

 

Faith and Reason 29: The Liahona

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From the book: Of Faith and Reason: 80 Evidences Supporting the Prophet Joseph Smith

by Michael R. Ash

During the Lehites sojourn through the Arabian wilderness, Lehi was given a device called the Liahona, which helped guide them on their journey. Nephi described the Liahona as round, made of brass, and containing two spindles or arrows. Nephi called the ball a “compass” and mentions that there were things written in the Liahona which gave them instructions.

While critics often claim that the compass was unknown in Lehi’s day, it’s important to note that the function of magnetic hematite –the principle core or iron– was well understood in both the Old and New Worlds before Lehi left Jerusalem. Magnetite, or Lodestone, is, of course, naturally magnetic iron, and the word magnetite comes from the name of a place in which it was mined in Asia Minor by at least the seventh century BC, namely Magnesia.

Michael R. Ash is the author of: Of Faith and Reason: 80 Evidences Supporting The Prophet Joseph Smith. He is the owner and operator of MormonFortress.com and is on the management team for FairMormon. He has been published in Sunstone, Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought, the Maxwell Institute’s FARMS Review, and is the author of Shaken Faith Syndrome: Strengthening One’s Testimony in the Face of Criticism and Doubt.  He and his wife live in Ogden, Utah, and have three daughters.

Julianne Dehlin Hatton  is a broadcast journalist living in Louisville, Kentucky. She has worked as a News Director at an NPR affiliate, Radio and Television Host, and Airborne Traffic Reporter. She graduated with an MSSc from the Maxwell School of Citizenship and Public Affairs at Syracuse University in 2008. Julianne and her husband Thomas are the parents of four children.

Music for Faith and Reason is provided by Arthur Hatton.

Articles of Faith 20: Geoff Biddulph – Why Didn’t The Church Teach Me This Stuff?

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Geoff BiddulphGeoff Biddulph is a convert to the Church of just over 15 years. Before joining he read a lot of anti-Mormon literature. However, it was the Spirit that converted him and helped him be open to being baptized. Since then, Geoff has read the book of Mormon more than 10 times and have read the entire Bible at least five times. He has a large library of Church-related material from which he draws upon as he writes for the Millennial Star blog—where he has contributed for nearly a decade. He his wife Cindy were married in the Denver temple nearly 11 years ago and they now have five kids. He is joining us by phone today from Denver, CO. Geoff is here to talk about an article he wrote for the Millennial Star Blog entitled, “Why Didn’t the Church Teach Me This Stuff”

Questions:

During your time as an LDS blogger, how have you seen the “bloggernacle” as it is often referred to, the catalog of blogs who claim some voice in the Mormon Community, how have you seen it change during that time?

While we seek to focus on Articles that come from what would be considered more academic or scholarly, we do find articles from time to time that strike an apologetic tone and regardless of the level of scholarship, the argument presented can help those struggling to reframe their position in such a way that might help calm the stormy waters of a faith crisis. Your article entitled, Why Didn’t the Church Teach Me This Stuff, was released on November 12th, 2014. This was a response to a gospel topics essay that the Church released on Polygamy in the early church, specifically during the Kirtland and Nauvoo periods. If you could, for those that haven’t read the article, summarize what one might find in that piece, specifically the parts that have caused some stir in public discourse recently.

The Church released its gospel topics essay Around October 22nd. A google search just this morning showed a massive amount of news outlets posting articles just three days ago (from the date of this recording), so on November 11th there seemed to be this bump in interest, which makes me wonder what about this topic seems to be keeping this subject around so long?

Your article is in response to a strain of discourse that centers around some discontent or uneasiness with the Church’s release of this gospel topics article. What is that position and why did that strike as something that warranted a response?

You ask the question of the reader but I want to turn it back on you, Why didn’t the Church teach me this stuff?

It is a difficult position to respond to because you don’t want to demean what someone is feeling, that kind of hurt or shock is sometimes not so easily dismissed. So, how does your article serve to address that dissonance?

This may sound like a loaded question or one that is hard to answer in a short podcast, but if people are feeling that the church hid this from them, it begs the question, what is the role or responsibility the church has towards its members with respect to topics such as this? All the lurid details as you put it in your article?

The article concludes:

The Church did teach you stuff about even controversial topics. Perhaps you were distracted or didn’t pay attention or were not curious enough to explore on your own. You are ultimately responsible for your own learning, and you are responsible for how you respond to new information. That is what that whole “free agency” thing is all about.

Articles of Faith Podcast: Dan Peterson – Reason, Experience, and the Existence of God

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DanPetersonBio: Daniel C. Peterson holds a Ph.D., University of California at Los Angeles, is a professor of Islamic studies and Arabic at Brigham Young University, and is the founder of the University’s Middle Eastern Texts Initiative, for which he served as editor-in-chief until mid-August 2013. He has published and spoken extensively on both Islamic and Mormon subjects. He is the author, among other things, of a biography entitled Muhammad: Prophet of God.

Formerly chairman of the board of the Foundation for Ancient Research and Mormon Studies (FARMS) and an officer, editor, and author for its successor organization, the Neal A. Maxwell Institute for Religious Scholarship, his professional work as an Arabist focuses on the Qur’an and on Islamic philosophical theology. Peterson is most recently, although it may not seem so recent anymore, Chairman and President of the Interpreter found at Mormon Interpreter dot com. He is here to today to talk about an article that he recently released for The Interpreter Journal entitled Reason, Experience, and the Existence of God.

Questions and topics addressed in the interview:

Dan Peterson, loved by some, agitating to others, and probably a variety of opinions in between. But how does Dan Peterson view Dan Peterson?

You have a blog on Patheos entitled Sic et Non. What does it really mean and how does that frame your writing on that blog?

When you are not blogging, you have other irons in many fires it seems. One of those efforts is the Interpreter. I don’t know that enough people are aware of what The Interpreter is or what it’s goals are as a foundation. Perhaps you could take a minute to offer a brief introduction.

Both your professional work at BYU and the subject of the articles we are going to be addressing today centers around Islam, which uses the Qur’an as its central scripture. When did you first say, “This Islam stuff, I think I ought to check this out. Qur’an, yeah that sounds like a light read.” What was the genesis of your interest in Islamic studies?

What value is there in the average Latter-day Saint in picking up the Qur’an and at least giving it a read let alone dedicate and study time to it? Is there tempering caution with such a thing?

Referring somewhat back to the title of your blog Sic et Non, your article in the interpreter essentially asks the main question Must human faith be completed by reason, or not? Is reason the genesis of faith or the other way around? Please set the stage for how this article came into being.

This article takes the reader on quite a journey so I want to try and help navigate that read. What I mean by that is the article starts out with what you’ve said, then it refers somewhat back to your work and studies with Islamic literature, and commentaries on it, then hits on alien radio transmissions, then back to Faith and Reason. So, let’s take the next step in the article

In Robert Reilly’s book, The Closing of the Muslim Mind, the case is brought up that Reason is the pre-requisite for revelation which you feel is a problematic foundation for the development of faith. Why is that?

A quote was repeated by Riley in his book, but the original quote was from Qadi ‘Abd al-Jabbar, an Islamic theologian that lived about 1000 years ago who said, “Reason first needs to establish the existence of God before undertaking the question as to whether God has spoken to man. Natural theology must be antecedent to theology.” On the surface that sounds fairly convincing, but you find this also problematic, in what way? Can reason alone establish the existence of God?

Is the assumption here that if one can reason that there is a God, then from there the idea of revelation becomes more approachable, less of a deceptive thing where the individual is just fooling themselves into believing in God is talking with them?

What then is the role of reason in authenticating revelation? Is faith, as was taught in Alma 32, the seed, and reason is the fertilizer or perhaps the soil for what grows up into revelation and, symbolically, the Tree of Life? It seems to me that works because reason has produced a variety of symbolic plants, but the seed that reason must foster is one that leads to eternal life.

As your article is a journey that seems to end where it began, only coupled now with reason and experience, this interview is brought back around to the Interpreter and its core value. You end your article with the following:
“The Interpreter Foundation was established on the premise that both reason and revelation have their place in determining religious truth. We believe reasoned investigation to be essential, but we will not discount revelation.”

Moving forward, how will we see this evident in the works of The Interpreter? I believe you have some new titles coming out in joint effort with Eborn Books. What are those?

Daniel C. Peterson is the Chairman and President of The Interpreter found at Mormon Interpreter dot com. A link to this article Reason, Experience, and the Existence of God will be found at the posting for this episode at blog.fairmormon.org.

Click here to read Daniel C. Peterson’s article in the Interpreter – Reason, Experience, and the Existence of God.